Saturday, February 2, 2008
Member since:
November 2007
November 2007
Ok, after getting the ONKYO TX-SR605 yesterday and after 4 hours of figuring out why the onscreen menus were difficult to appear on my HDTV via the HDMI outputs, I was finally ready to enjoy what this reciever had in store for my ears as well as my eyes. I had a slight communication ploblem between the reciever and my HDTV's HDMI slot 1 input, after several attempts reading the manual and trying to figure it out what was wrong I just decided to place the HDMI out on the reciever to the HDMI input 2 slot on the TV, finally everything was online including the reciever's onscreen menu (since then I've had no problems). I also hooked my brother's 605 up as well and ran into a simular problem, but for some odd reason my 605 was more difficult.
SOUND:Before you even think about just hooking up any ONKYO reciever (605, 705, 805 , etc...) it would be wise to auto calibrate your surround speakers first. Just inserting the calibration microphone plung into the front of the reciever will automatically start the Audissey (hope I spelled the correctly) calibration setup. It takes about 10-15 minutes to complete.
Now I was ready to listen to an uncompressed audio codec. Since I only have a 5.1 setup, I set my PS3 to all of the 1.5 Mbps codecs (dts and DD) and configered the PS3 to play LPCM 5.1, you can also add 7.1 as well. Now for my first test, I put in the The Fifth Element: Remastered and set the soudtrack on the PS3 to DolbyThrueHD 5.1, I then hit the display button to show how many Mbps the track was playing at. The DTHD track was between 2.5-2.7Mbps. Then I switched to the LPCM track and before even looking at the display I immediately heard the difference. The LPCM track was 2 Mbps more than the DTHD track (but these are just my ears).
As far as music I think my SONY (less than a year old and never calibrated) HT reciever sounds better. For a video game test I put in NBA LIVE 08' and man was it a great experience with DD. The arena effects were like you were sitting in the front row.
VIDEO UPCONVERSION: The Fifth Element: Remastered was just as stunning as if the PS3 was hooked directly into the HDTV, as far as SDVD's go, well let's just say that everything remained the same after I popped in The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring. It maybe because I have the entry model unit and not one of the more expensive models, but as long as I did'nt lose any picture quality, I'm good.
Setup gets a grade of C-: The OSC was difficult to obtain.
Auto Speaker Calibration gets a grade of A+: Much easier than my SONY.
Sound quality gets a grade of A-: The LPCM and DTHD codecs sound better than the 1.5 Mbps codecs (dts and DD)
Video gets a C: Disappointed that the upconversion was stil the same, but as long as it not at a lesser video quality I'm cool.
Over all the ONKYO TX-SR605 get a very nice B+, better yet make it an A because now that I reflect on it, it does have on board dts HDMA and DTHD decoders.
Would I recommend this reciever? Yes, especially for anyone who does'nt have alot of money to spend and their HT room is limited. At 90wpc it's ideal for a small HT room providing everything you'll ever need in an A/V reciever.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 2, 2008]
SOUND:Before you even think about just hooking up any ONKYO reciever (605, 705, 805 , etc...) it would be wise to auto calibrate your surround speakers first. Just inserting the calibration microphone plung into the front of the reciever will automatically start the Audissey (hope I spelled the correctly) calibration setup. It takes about 10-15 minutes to complete.
Now I was ready to listen to an uncompressed audio codec. Since I only have a 5.1 setup, I set my PS3 to all of the 1.5 Mbps codecs (dts and DD) and configered the PS3 to play LPCM 5.1, you can also add 7.1 as well. Now for my first test, I put in the The Fifth Element: Remastered and set the soudtrack on the PS3 to DolbyThrueHD 5.1, I then hit the display button to show how many Mbps the track was playing at. The DTHD track was between 2.5-2.7Mbps. Then I switched to the LPCM track and before even looking at the display I immediately heard the difference. The LPCM track was 2 Mbps more than the DTHD track (but these are just my ears).
As far as music I think my SONY (less than a year old and never calibrated) HT reciever sounds better. For a video game test I put in NBA LIVE 08' and man was it a great experience with DD. The arena effects were like you were sitting in the front row.
VIDEO UPCONVERSION: The Fifth Element: Remastered was just as stunning as if the PS3 was hooked directly into the HDTV, as far as SDVD's go, well let's just say that everything remained the same after I popped in The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring. It maybe because I have the entry model unit and not one of the more expensive models, but as long as I did'nt lose any picture quality, I'm good.
Setup gets a grade of C-: The OSC was difficult to obtain.
Auto Speaker Calibration gets a grade of A+: Much easier than my SONY.
Sound quality gets a grade of A-: The LPCM and DTHD codecs sound better than the 1.5 Mbps codecs (dts and DD)
Video gets a C: Disappointed that the upconversion was stil the same, but as long as it not at a lesser video quality I'm cool.
Over all the ONKYO TX-SR605 get a very nice B+, better yet make it an A because now that I reflect on it, it does have on board dts HDMA and DTHD decoders.
Would I recommend this reciever? Yes, especially for anyone who does'nt have alot of money to spend and their HT room is limited. At 90wpc it's ideal for a small HT room providing everything you'll ever need in an A/V reciever.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 2, 2008]
Saturday, February 2, 2008
Member since:
March 2002
March 2002
Thanks, Tony.
I'm still curious about the accuracy of the built-in speaker calibration. Do you have access to a sound meter to test the output of each of the speakers (from the listening position) now that the player set-up has adjusted them?
John
I'm still curious about the accuracy of the built-in speaker calibration. Do you have access to a sound meter to test the output of each of the speakers (from the listening position) now that the player set-up has adjusted them?
John
Saturday, February 2, 2008
Member since:
November 2007
November 2007
John,
I wish I did have a meter, but unfortunatlely I don't. I left everything up to the reciever. Even at low levels the uncompressed audio is still impressive, almost too impressive. The LFE can be overwhelming if you're not expecting it ( I had turn down the bass on the subwoofer). I was just watching Resident Evil: Apocolyps when out of the blue was a crash scene with a mother load of LFE. What I do find interesting is the Night Time Audio. Since I have kids this should help when viewing at night and hopefully tone down the bass.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 2, 2008]
I wish I did have a meter, but unfortunatlely I don't. I left everything up to the reciever. Even at low levels the uncompressed audio is still impressive, almost too impressive. The LFE can be overwhelming if you're not expecting it ( I had turn down the bass on the subwoofer). I was just watching Resident Evil: Apocolyps when out of the blue was a crash scene with a mother load of LFE. What I do find interesting is the Night Time Audio. Since I have kids this should help when viewing at night and hopefully tone down the bass.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 2, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
March 2002
March 2002
Thanks again, Tony. When I get the 705 in a month or so, I'll try out the internal setup procedure and then measure the speaker outputs. Right now, I have all my speakers but the center set for the same decibel reading at the primary listening postion. I have the center speaker turned down about 3 db or so because, otherwise, I find most center-channel activity too prominent.
Interesting that you would find what appears to be more dynamic impact after the new calibration, though. I wonder if the setup is simply setting the bass louder, or if it is adding additional dynamic range (dynamic enhancement), or if you were not used to hearing uncompressed PCM/TrueHD/DTS MA, or if maybe before the calibration you might have had your bass set too low. (I assume you had previously set the speaker levels by ear?)
John
[Post edited by John J. Puccio on Feb 3, 2008]
Interesting that you would find what appears to be more dynamic impact after the new calibration, though. I wonder if the setup is simply setting the bass louder, or if it is adding additional dynamic range (dynamic enhancement), or if you were not used to hearing uncompressed PCM/TrueHD/DTS MA, or if maybe before the calibration you might have had your bass set too low. (I assume you had previously set the speaker levels by ear?)
John
[Post edited by John J. Puccio on Feb 3, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
January 2004
January 2004
I am always leery of the auto-calibration-microphone routines that receivers use. They tend to use speaker sizes (SMALL, LARGE) as part of their setups. For example, if you have floor standing front speakers, they will invariably be set to LARGE. If you have a large center speaker, it will be set to LARGE as well.
You would think that this would be proper, but in fact this is NOT what you want to do. When front and center speakers are set to large, then a good portion of the LFE audio that should be sent to your subwoofer ends up being sent to your front and center speakers (especially the fronts). Because of this mismatch, your levels are often off, with the center speaker becoming less present than your fronts. Every audiophile website I have ever visited all recommend against using a receiver's autosetup mics and routines, and all recommend the use of a sound level meter to calibrate home theater audio receivers.
The best way to calibrate your speakers is to buy a sound level meter, which are easily found at Radio Shack, Circuit City and the like, usually for around 25-50 dollars, and , using your receivers test tone mode, manually set all your speaker sizes to SMALL, and all speaker levels so that the sound level meter measures 75db from each one, with the possible exception of the subwoofer, which can be set to 85db (The reason for this is that the lower frequencies have larger wavelengths and the extra decibels help push the "oomf". If you find the bass is too loud, at the very least, make sure the level is at 75db).
EDIT: Tony, if your receiver is calibrated properly, you shouldn't have to turn down your subwoofer. Using Night Mode so you don't disturb others is a different story of course, but when you listen to a movie soundtrack under normal conditions, you should never have to adjust your sub. Again, I highly recommend purchasing a SPL meter and checking your setup manually.
[Post edited by Kilgore on Feb 3, 2008]
You would think that this would be proper, but in fact this is NOT what you want to do. When front and center speakers are set to large, then a good portion of the LFE audio that should be sent to your subwoofer ends up being sent to your front and center speakers (especially the fronts). Because of this mismatch, your levels are often off, with the center speaker becoming less present than your fronts. Every audiophile website I have ever visited all recommend against using a receiver's autosetup mics and routines, and all recommend the use of a sound level meter to calibrate home theater audio receivers.
The best way to calibrate your speakers is to buy a sound level meter, which are easily found at Radio Shack, Circuit City and the like, usually for around 25-50 dollars, and , using your receivers test tone mode, manually set all your speaker sizes to SMALL, and all speaker levels so that the sound level meter measures 75db from each one, with the possible exception of the subwoofer, which can be set to 85db (The reason for this is that the lower frequencies have larger wavelengths and the extra decibels help push the "oomf". If you find the bass is too loud, at the very least, make sure the level is at 75db).
EDIT: Tony, if your receiver is calibrated properly, you shouldn't have to turn down your subwoofer. Using Night Mode so you don't disturb others is a different story of course, but when you listen to a movie soundtrack under normal conditions, you should never have to adjust your sub. Again, I highly recommend purchasing a SPL meter and checking your setup manually.
[Post edited by Kilgore on Feb 3, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
July 2006
July 2006
Tony, nice review. Thanks for taking the time out to write it. One question, does the calibration microphone come with the receiver or did you get it seperately? I have always wanted to try one out to see if it would improve my sound since I always set my levels manually. After reading Kilgores post (thank you also Kilgore for that good information) I might buy a sound level meter and see what that does for me.
Now I'm torn between the 605 and 805. I want the 805 but it costs more than twice the price of the 605 on Ebay.
BTW Tony, I saw a Toshiba HD-XA2 (used) sell on Ebay for $300. I saw the email after the auction ended
Also for anyone interested, there's an Onkyo TX SR805 on Ebay (used) currently going for $360 but with 6 days left on the auction this price will go up quite a bit still. The difference between the 605 and 805 is you get 40 watts more per channel on the 805 along with the Burr Brown audio DAC which is supposed to be a little bit better, not sure if it's significant though. Here's the auction link...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ONKYO-TX-SR805-AV-RECEIVER_W0QQitemZ350021672652QQihZ022QQcategoryZ14981QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[Post edited by Falcon01 on Feb 3, 2008]
Now I'm torn between the 605 and 805. I want the 805 but it costs more than twice the price of the 605 on Ebay.
BTW Tony, I saw a Toshiba HD-XA2 (used) sell on Ebay for $300. I saw the email after the auction ended
Also for anyone interested, there's an Onkyo TX SR805 on Ebay (used) currently going for $360 but with 6 days left on the auction this price will go up quite a bit still. The difference between the 605 and 805 is you get 40 watts more per channel on the 805 along with the Burr Brown audio DAC which is supposed to be a little bit better, not sure if it's significant though. Here's the auction link...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ONKYO-TX-SR805-AV-RECEIVER_W0QQitemZ350021672652QQihZ022QQcategoryZ14981QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[Post edited by Falcon01 on Feb 3, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
November 2007
November 2007
John and Kilgore,
Thanks fellas for great advice, John I think you have a point, eventhough I've heard unconpressed before (2x last year), it was not on a regular basis. After thinking about it and reading what Kilgore said, I've decided to turn down the decibel level on the sub from 100 to 75 on the reciever.
EDIT: Falcon, the mlc came with the reciever,as far as the 805 goes if you have the shelf space (John mentioned and I agree that the 805 is a bit beefy and weights in at 50lbs) and you're HT room is large than I would recommend the 805. The 605 was perfect for me in every way.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 3, 2008]
Thanks fellas for great advice, John I think you have a point, eventhough I've heard unconpressed before (2x last year), it was not on a regular basis. After thinking about it and reading what Kilgore said, I've decided to turn down the decibel level on the sub from 100 to 75 on the reciever.
EDIT: Falcon, the mlc came with the reciever,as far as the 805 goes if you have the shelf space (John mentioned and I agree that the 805 is a bit beefy and weights in at 50lbs) and you're HT room is large than I would recommend the 805. The 605 was perfect for me in every way.
[Post edited by tony1569 on Feb 3, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
October 2007
October 2007
Falcon01, the calibration microphone is provided.
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
January 2008
January 2008
Hey,
Falcon, for the 805, more money but well worth the investment.
Tony, another trick for you is to go by your local sound shop(Music/Soundstage dealer) and rent an SPL meter. That my friend that will give you a final indication if the theatre settings are properly calibrated. I bought myself one, when I started in this insustry and have never looked back. Set the reference level on the SPL to 75db (believe it or not that same setting Lucas uses for THX) Go into your setup for levels, now with the SPL you can fine tune the settings in the receiver speaker by speaker. You will find that maybe only two or three maybe out. Mine there was just the center and one of the surrounds.
For the most part settings in the receiver are default to small. This is a good thing, however, the large settings, does not indicate the speaker will perform better. Read you manual first. Most Onkyos reccomend small settings, due to bass support. I have three Subs, so it makes perfect sence, that all my base management is done there. The older models of Onkyo would not allow bass to transfer, when the settings were to large. Check with the manual.
Anyways sorry to hear of the problems you had with setting it up. You will find after a 100 hours or so the amp will really start to perform!!! Question, when you ripped it out of the box did you read the starter manual? LOL Most men don't....
Oh oh, Big hint. If you have your sub levels out higher, say 7 or 8 vs 1 or 2, turn the gain down on your subs, vol level 3 mayber 4, depending on how responsive your sub is, you will get the feel for bass really quick... You bass will be deeper, and will not go off as often, but when it does, it is that more effective to the listening experience. I learned this a few years ago when I got my CEDIA Certification. Most conusmers, just turn the vol up on the sub. That is very bad for you sub. High Level input/low vol = KICK ASS BASS... John is right, 75hz is a safe setting. If you have more than one sub, adjust the smaller sub to 150hz. You'd be surprised the fun you can have...
[Post edited by ReaggieP on Feb 3, 2008]
Falcon, for the 805, more money but well worth the investment.
Tony, another trick for you is to go by your local sound shop(Music/Soundstage dealer) and rent an SPL meter. That my friend that will give you a final indication if the theatre settings are properly calibrated. I bought myself one, when I started in this insustry and have never looked back. Set the reference level on the SPL to 75db (believe it or not that same setting Lucas uses for THX) Go into your setup for levels, now with the SPL you can fine tune the settings in the receiver speaker by speaker. You will find that maybe only two or three maybe out. Mine there was just the center and one of the surrounds.
For the most part settings in the receiver are default to small. This is a good thing, however, the large settings, does not indicate the speaker will perform better. Read you manual first. Most Onkyos reccomend small settings, due to bass support. I have three Subs, so it makes perfect sence, that all my base management is done there. The older models of Onkyo would not allow bass to transfer, when the settings were to large. Check with the manual.
Anyways sorry to hear of the problems you had with setting it up. You will find after a 100 hours or so the amp will really start to perform!!! Question, when you ripped it out of the box did you read the starter manual? LOL Most men don't....
Oh oh, Big hint. If you have your sub levels out higher, say 7 or 8 vs 1 or 2, turn the gain down on your subs, vol level 3 mayber 4, depending on how responsive your sub is, you will get the feel for bass really quick... You bass will be deeper, and will not go off as often, but when it does, it is that more effective to the listening experience. I learned this a few years ago when I got my CEDIA Certification. Most conusmers, just turn the vol up on the sub. That is very bad for you sub. High Level input/low vol = KICK ASS BASS... John is right, 75hz is a safe setting. If you have more than one sub, adjust the smaller sub to 150hz. You'd be surprised the fun you can have...
[Post edited by ReaggieP on Feb 3, 2008]
Sunday, February 3, 2008
Member since:
November 2007
November 2007
Thanks ReaggieP,
Your advice will be taken to heart. After reading the manual for hooking up my brother's 605 I felt as though I did'need to read it again, but after the initial setup reading the manaul again was necessary, but it still did'nt help with the HDMI input on the TV , that solution came after an hour of frustration.
You are right about listening to the reciever for a few. I love this unit and the longer I use it the more I'm falling in love with it. The only thing is the HDMI switching is a little slow but exceptable.
Your advice will be taken to heart. After reading the manual for hooking up my brother's 605 I felt as though I did'need to read it again, but after the initial setup reading the manaul again was necessary, but it still did'nt help with the HDMI input on the TV , that solution came after an hour of frustration.
You are right about listening to the reciever for a few. I love this unit and the longer I use it the more I'm falling in love with it. The only thing is the HDMI switching is a little slow but exceptable.
